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Old 24-01-2009, 7:46 am  
istvan
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Dear Thien thu,

The 5 steps towards acceptance are not my own invention. They come from research in psycholohy and it only shows the steps the human psyche goes through in the process of acceptance. They are the normal steps into acceptin something. Some of us go though these steps quicker or slower. We, humans, cannot accept anything just as it is. Our mind is just built that way.

As for those who come to my seminars: I do not chose them, they chose me.
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"Opposite of life is not death, but indifference" Ellie Wiessel
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Dưới đây là 3 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến istvan vì bài post hữu ích này:
farhad (24-01-2009), georgy (24-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Old 24-01-2009, 9:10 am  
thien thu 2
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Dear Istvan,

i HAVE WISHED to share my thoughts ON YOUR POST; i do not intend to spark a debate.

But actually WE do not speak the same language! You brought up a question in terms of a psychologist and i mistook it as ...as a spiritual terminology since somebody had mentioned about Master Dang's teaching on ABSOLUTE FREEDOM.

AGAIN MY SINCERE APOLOGY!

THIEN THU
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Dưới đây là 3 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến thien thu 2 vì bài post hữu ích này:
farhad (24-01-2009), georgy (24-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Old 24-01-2009, 12:46 pm  
farhad
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Nguyên văn bởi thien thu 2 View Post
2.If we ARE NOT an UNLOCKED ( or at least being a ...spiritual master receiving revelations from High Beings ...as Master Dang used to stress when conducting UE seminars) we cannot "give spiritual lectures" or even "teach" what was taught by Buddha/ Jesus Christ / Mohamad ( ONLY we can convey our interpretation/understanding of WHAT we understood from those "religious literatures"! By no means we have the right/ability to "force" listeners to accept what we understood- THAT is absolute freedom which Master Dang had taught us, hadn't he )
In this case, those who come to attend the seminar YOU conduct are just ....seminar participants, NOT your students (sorry)!
Dear Thien Thu,
I really like what I quote.
Can you further share your understanding of steps we go through to get UNLOCKED and reach spiritual acceptance?
I will also greatly appreciate if you can contribute into my understanding of the difference between regular and spiritual acceptance.
I'm looking forward to benefit from your experience and understanding.
Thank you in advance.
farhad
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Our freedom is to let others be free Master Dang
Наша свобода в том, чтобы давать свободу другим Мастер Данг

Сказка - ложь, да в ней намек... Anything expressed is but a hint...
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Dưới đây là 3 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến farhad vì bài post hữu ích này:
georgy (24-01-2009), lotus (24-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Old 24-01-2009, 3:34 pm  
Darza
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Dear Istvan,

I just wish to share a few thoughts about my excerpts of yours:

1.Why do we have to go through FIVE steps toward "acceptance" ?
We can accept anything ( everything) "as is" and let the calmness inside
us to resolve the "fact".
a. When you started denying you would have sure based on your viewpoint
for your accessment/judgement which was more or less "subjective",
wasn't it?
b.anger : please stay away with it! ( for your own sake!)
c.bargaining (?) - with who? for what purpose?
d.depression : because you have lost your view?
e.acceptance : thanks goodness : this can be the first position to take to
reach "stillness".

2.If we ARE NOT an UNLOCKED ( or at least being a ...spiritual master receiving revelations from High Beings ...as Master Dang used to stress when conducting UE seminars) we cannot "give spiritual lectures" or even "teach" what was taught by Buddha/ Jesus Christ / Mohamad ( ONLY we can convey our interpretation/understanding of WHAT we understood from those "religious literatures"! By no means we have the right/ability to "force" listeners to accept what we understood- THAT is absolute freedom which Master Dang had taught us, hadn't he )
In this case, those who come to attend the seminar YOU conduct are just ....seminar participants, NOT your students ( sorry)!

I do apologize for my straight-forward statements.

Thien thu
Hi Thien Thu,

On your first point. Did you see the vid? To me it was a clear summary on processes in the human mind when receiving new info. Like e.g. with loss, grief.

When you heard the master died did you accept immediately? Myself i first felt numbness, i did not understand. I never expected it. Then there was this unexpected lighter feeling. I did not feel sad and did not know why. After a day or so it hit me why i felt more free. The Master was my last crutch. I longed to stand on my own feet but there was also the Master. By his death he gave me freedom, space to be sovereign. After this insight i could accept. It took me at least a full day to get to the acceptance part.

With the anger you say stay away. Is this accepting? When i feel anger i fully accept it. I stay with it using awareness. It dissipates as of itself. This is what i do with all negativity, i pay close attention to the what and why i feel it. This is how i practiced "cleaning the mind" to free myself of old anger.To reach inner-harmony.

When someone gets angry at me, same thing. I focus awareness on it. It helps me to determine to what extend i am responsible for that anger, to what extend i still have i-ness. To deepen my inner-peace.

Your second point, the unblocking. Is the blocking not a form of denial? In order to accept our blocks do we not need to be aware of what they are? Will this awareness not dissolve these blocks? The power of acceptance?
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Dưới đây là 3 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến Darza vì bài post hữu ích này:
farhad (24-01-2009), georgy (24-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Old 24-01-2009, 4:25 pm  
thien thu 2
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Dear Farhad,

1. First I wish to say that I cannot share with you "the steps to go through to reach the state of being Unlocked" for the mere reason that I am NOT unlocked yet!

An unlocked spiritual practitioner is the one who reach the stage where he/she can gain knowledge/wisdom on everything without having to USE the "thinking ability" of the BRAIN. He/she can attain "super consciousness" of the Great Self through deep "samadi" (?) : the door to enlightenment is "unlocked" ( Sorry I don't have enough frequently used spiritual terminology to express myself!)


2. For what you called "spiritual acceptance" I just mean a kind of acceptance one should "accept as is" during his/her spiritual cultivation process thanks to a non-attachment concept-detachment- ( without assessment/evaluation/judgement/criticism etc...as Master Dang had many-a-times insisted in various seminars).

Regular acceptance, to my understanding, is a process devised by psychologists for a sound/logic approach to deal with a fact.

"Learning is sharing" is what I am trying to do in this forum; I have no point "showing up" in any way.

Thank you for your interest in my post.

Thien thu
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Dưới đây là 4 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến thien thu 2 vì bài post hữu ích này:
farhad (24-01-2009), georgy (24-01-2009), lotus (24-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Old 24-01-2009, 4:32 pm  
istvan
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Dear Thien thu,

No need to appologize. I like your reply to my post. And i apreciate what you shared about about teaching. Maybe we could move the discussion to it's thread: Instructing Methodology. Psychology is a very important part in teaching. In university i have learned psychology for 1 year specifically for teaching. And as a high school teacher I apply it every day.

Our school uses a slightly different pedagogy. It is indeed very important to receive messages while you teach and this makes it impossible to fully plan your class.

Could we say that spirituality is the souls psychology?

Love,
Istvan

PS.: I like debating ideas as it seems it's the only form of activity on this forum and this way we can all learn.
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"Opposite of life is not death, but indifference" Ellie Wiessel
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Dưới đây là 3 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến istvan vì bài post hữu ích này:
farhad (24-01-2009), georgy (24-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Old 24-01-2009, 8:14 pm  
Darza
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Dear Thien thu,
PS.: I like debating ideas as it seems it's the only form of activity on this forum and this way we can all learn.
Myself, i am not into debating. With me everyone is right from their point of view. Who am i to disagree with another? I am into sharing experience. Connecting with those that recognize or resonate with these experiences. If i see someone else sharing an experience i share mine on the same subject. This way the person can easily see if i understood what they described. If i am on the mark they are happy.

From my experience debating is from the mind. If the goal is to realize lasting freedom, how can that be done using the mind? The mind is limited by nature. Absolute freedom is a label that points to an experience beyond the mind. A subjective experience not translatable into words.
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Dưới đây là 3 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến Darza vì bài post hữu ích này:
13cdmitriy (02-02-2009), farhad (24-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Old 24-01-2009, 8:34 pm  
Darza
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Dear Farhad,

1. First I wish to say that I cannot share with you "the steps to go through to reach the state of being Unlocked" for the mere reason that I am NOT unlocked yet!

An unlocked spiritual practitioner is the one who reach the stage where he/she can gain knowledge/wisdom on everything without having to USE the "thinking ability" of the BRAIN. He/she can attain "super consciousness" of the Great Self through deep "samadi" (?) : the door to enlightenment is "unlocked" ( Sorry I don't have enough frequently used spiritual terminology to express myself!)
Thien thu
From what i know indeed the unblocked state points to something other then thinking. It points to knowing from within, from inner-knowing or intuition, knowing from the heart.

The mind has a limit. In advertising it is called the flicker frequency. The mind can cope with so many changes per unit of time, like 24 frames per second. The changes are worldwide accelerating to a level beyond the limits of the mind. I expect it to happen this year. Then there will be so many changes the mind will no longer be able to cope. It will go in shock, the zombie state, maybe go unconsciousness, or there will be surrender. Then consciousness takes over. One aligns with the flow of creation. Consciousness has no limits. It can cope with any number of changes it is presented with. Then one becomes a co-creator, co create the Long Hoa festival. Party time!
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Dưới đây là 4 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến Darza vì bài post hữu ích này:
13cdmitriy (02-02-2009), farhad (24-01-2009), thien thu 2 (25-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Acceptance
Old 25-01-2009, 3:14 am  
an_li1
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The way I would see it,is that in spirituality for a good spiritual practicioner,that sequence of stages goes probably faster,and for an enlightened mind,often it is not there,it just goes straight to acceptance and equanimity--live in the presence without resistance to what is.
However,no matter how much someone can be enlightened,one could still be challenged to go trough those steps--like in the life of Jesus Christ and the last moments of His life.
So,i guess it is a spectrum--as much a being is enlightened,going trough those steps is faster,and often there is Equanimity to what is.
And as much someone is in the clutches of the maya,resistance is all there is to it.
Eckhart Tolle has written that mind is resistance (I guess he meant the every day mind most of us use) ,all those thoughts and emotions repeating in our heads were once resistance to what is that got a life on its own,fueled trough the resistance to what has happned at some point--trauma,or whatever kind of event that went against the natural flow of the being.
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Dưới đây là 5 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến an_li1 vì bài post hữu ích này:
13cdmitriy (02-02-2009), farhad (26-01-2009), istvan (25-01-2009), thien thu 2 (25-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
Old 25-01-2009, 7:27 am  
thien thu 2
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Dear an_li 1,

Thank you for your post regarding acceptance: what you stated was definitely true. No matter how we keep ourselves alert toward detachment we have to keep it in constant presence or else there always be a ...struggle between the ...ever thinking mind ( an "untamed horse") and the consciousness( awareness in equanimity or "genuine" stillness, so to speak!).

But if we are constantly aware of this struggle then we can always "stop" providing fuel to the thinking mind to work! And we'll automatically regain our stillness, won't we?

Thus wouldn't it be better to accept anything "as is" rather then go through the whole "five-step process" including the mind's resistance to achieve ...surrendered acceptance?

I am sorry : I fail to conceive/ understand the concept
"spirituality is the soul's psychology!!

Thien thu
Trả Lời Với Trích Dẫn
Dưới đây là 5 người đã gửi lời cảm ơn đến thien thu 2 vì bài post hữu ích này:
13cdmitriy (02-02-2009), an_li1 (29-01-2009), farhad (26-01-2009), istvan (25-01-2009), Тихомирова Т. (06-02-2009)
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